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Archive for the ‘Agnosticism’ Category

Anatole France:

An education isn’t how much you have committed to memory, or even how much you know. It’s being able to differentiate between what you do know and what you don’t.

Eliezer_Yudkowsky:

Reality has been around since long before you showed up. Don’t go calling it nasty names like “bizarre” or “incredible”. The universe was propagating complex amplitudes through configuration space for ten billion years before life ever emerged on Earth. Quantum physics is not “weird”. You are weird.

Steven Novella:

Questioning our own motives, and our own process, is critical to a skeptical and scientific outlook. We must realize that the default mode of human psychology is to grab onto comforting beliefs for purely emotional reasons, and then justify those beliefs to ourselves with post-hoc rationalizations. It takes effort to rise above this tendency, to step back from our beliefs and our emotional connection to conclusions and focus on the process. The process (i.e science, logic, and intellectual rigor) has to be more important than the belief.

Arthur C. Clarke:

Sometimes I think we’re alone in the universe, and sometimes I think we’re not. In either case, the idea is quite staggering.

Carl Sagan:

In science it often happens that scientists say, ‘You know that’s a really good argument; my position is mistaken,’ and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn’t happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion.

Galileo:

Long experience has taught me this about the status of mankind with regard to matters requiring thought: the less people know and understand about them, the more positively they attempt to argue concerning them, while on the other hand to know and understand a multitude of things renders men cautious in passing judgment upon anything new.

Goethe, 18th/19th-century German poet, novelist, playwright and philosopher:
You can easily judge the character of a man by how he treats those who can do nothing for him.

Thomas Paine:

It is error only, and not truth, that shrinks from inquiry.

Martin Gardner:

Biographical history, as taught in our public schools, is still largely a history of boneheads: ridiculous kings and queens, paranoid political leaders, compulsive voyagers, ignorant generals – the flotsam and jetsam of historical currents. The men who radically altered history, the great scientists and mathematicians, are seldom mentioned, if at all.

Randall Monroe (Author XKCD):

You don’t use science to show you’re right, you use science to become right.

Mark Twain

The difference between the right word and the almost right word is the difference between lightning and a lightning bug.

Bertrand Russell

There are two motives for reading a book: one, that you enjoy it; the other, that you can boast about it.

From Sara Robinson, explaining perfectly the entire reason for the faux controversy over the “ground zero mosque”:

Conservatives can do without a god, but they can’t get through the day without a devil. Their entire model of reality revolves around the existence of an existential enemy who’s out to annihilate them. Take that focal point away, and their whole worldview collapses into incoherence. This need is so central to their thinking that if there are no actual enemies around, they’ll go to considerable lengths to make some (or just make some up).

Sir Winston Churchill:

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened.

William Osler:

One special advantage of the skeptical attitude of mind is that a man is never vexed to find that after all he has been in the wrong.

Fred Brooks:

You can learn more from failure than success. In failure you’re forced to find out what part did not work. But in success you can believe everything you did was great, when in fact some parts may not have worked at all. Failure forces you to face reality.

Unknown:

The best substitute for brains is silence.

John Cleese:

The really good idea is always traceable back quite a long way, often to a not very good idea which sparked off another idea that was only slightly better, which somebody else misunderstood in such a way that they then said something which was really rather interesting.

kim hebert:

homeopathy is like paying to watch your body heal itself.

Samuel Butler

The man who lets himself be bored is even more contemptible than the bore.

PZ Myers, on burying his bible:

And so I have. I have treated my copies of the Koran and the Bible with greater respect than they deserve.

Right now, the pages swell with moisture, the fibers separate and the chapters turn into pulpy masses. Bacteria bloom and their colonies expand; fungi flourish and their hyphae infiltrate and convert cellulose into spores. The ink runs as nematodes writhe over the surfaces, etching the words with slime and replacing the follies of dead men with the wisdom of worms. The roots of flowers and grasses will fumble downwards to embrace the decaying leaves, and the roots of trees will impale the volumes laterally. Given only a little time, the madness will be reduced to compost.

At every instant in this gradual process of degradation, the books are being improved and given greater value. And with my decision to discard the poisonous symbols of past ignorance, I became a little more free.

J.B.S. Haldane:

My practice as a scientist is atheistic. That is to say, when I set up an experiment I assume that no god, angel or devil is going to interfere with its course; and this assumption has been justified by such success as I have achieved in my professional career. I should therefore be intellectually dishonest if I were not also atheistic in the affairs of the world.

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friends, these are my most recent biannual quotes i have read and enjoyed; please comment if you also enjoy.  :)

Thomas Paine (via froggey):

Any system of religion that has anything in it that shocks the mind of a child, cannot be a true system.”

Goethe:

Nothing is worth more than this day.

Peter Walker:

The supreme arrogance of religious thinking: that a carbon-based bag of mostly water on a spec of iron-silicate dust around a boring dwarf star … would look up at the sky and declare, ‘It was all made so that I could exist!

H.G. Wells:

When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race”

Bertrand Russell:

Of all forms of caution, caution in love is perhaps the most fatal to true happiness.

Neil deGrasse Tyson:

The stars in the universe far outnumber all the words ever uttered by all the humans who have ever lived.

Aldous Huxley:

At least two-thirds of our miseries spring from human stupidity, human malice and those great motivators and justifiers of malice and stupidity: idealism, dogmatism and proselytizing zeal on behalf of religous or political ideas.

Brennen McKenzie:

If you try to picture a pack of Chihuahuas bringing down and savaging an elk, the impact of thousands of years of artificial selection is obvious.

John Cage:

I can’t understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I’m frightened of the old ones.

Bob McCue (oh, how i heart mister mccue):

The most satisfying aspect of parenthood so far has been witnessing my children come into their own as adults. Becoming friends with these surprising human beings is as fresh as life gets. In this and so many other ways, life is sweet. I am a lucky guy who spends most of each day feeling grateful.

R. Feynman:

Physics is like sex. Sure, it may give some practical results, but that’s not why we do it.

Gerald Massey

They must find it difficult, those who have taken authority as the truth, rather than truth as the authority.

Arthur C. Clarke (in his Third Law of Prediction):

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

John Erskine

Music is the only language in which you cannot say a mean or sarcastic thing.

Richard Dawkins:

Hydrogen is a tasteless, invisible gas – and if you give it enough time, it will turn into people.

Anon:

Every morning I wake up on the wrong side of Capitalism.

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Which of the following is more inclusive and better represents the ideals of maximum freedom as outlined in the US constitution? (h/t)

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under the gods, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under no God or gods, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands; one nation indivisible with liberty and justice for all.
Interjects that the person must adhere to a monotheistic belief system. Interjects that the person must adhere to a polytheistic belief system. Interjects that the person must not adhere to any theistic belief system. Does not interject any presuppositions about religion. The person is free to believe whatever they want.

Happy Independence Day, y’all. As the German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche said, “The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself.”

I invite you to read that quote 1nce more. Have fun today. :)

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Correspondence between me and my auntie ____ (9 feb. 2009).

From my auntie:

Markii, I was thinking about you over the week end.  I have 3 questions I’d like to ask you and am looking forward to hearing from you!

One.  With your new knowledge I was wondering
.  What do you believe you were doing or where were you before your sojourn on earth.

2.  What is your purpose on earth?

3.  Where do you believe or think the human race will go when we die?

Thanks  love you so much.  Auntie ____

My response…

thanks for the e-mail, ____.  i’ll do my best to answer below…

One.  With your new knowledge I was wondering
.  What do you believe you were doing or where were you before your sojourn on earth.

that’s a great question!  many people have tried to solve it, but i think it’s unsolvable.  i do not know where i was before my sojourn to earth.  i don’t know if i even “was”, or existed.  it is possible that our consciousness we now enjoy only recently matured and came to be as our minds physically developed during childhood.  i find this to sound more plausible than the idea that we are hundreds or thousands of years old human beings with that many years of learning and education behind us and yet here we only know that which we learn here.  is our older and wiser self sitting dormant in our mind while the two-year old biological self now learns to eat food and drools applesauce out of his mouth/nose?  and a middle-aged person who was mentally fine can have a car accident or disease in the brain and lose many motor and thinking skills, and many times even having a complete change in their personality and habits [click link to left, and 'save as', to hear mp3 on this] as a result?  a car accident or mental disease affects the tissue and neurons in the brain which then change how a thousand year-old sentient behaves/acts?  to me it seems more logical that there is a machine, but no “ghost in the machine”. (more…)

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Dwight D. Eisenhower:

In preparing for battle, I have found that planning is essential, but plans are useless.

Kail Nielson:

A man who says, “If God is dead, nothing matters,” is a spoilt child who has never looked at his fellow men with compassion.

Robert Green Ingersoll:

This crime called blasphemy was invented by priests for the purpose of defending doctrines not able to take care of themselves.

Dan Christiansen, BYU Student:

As a child, it seemed so simple;
Every step was clearly marked.
Priesthood, mission, sweetheart, temple;
Bright with hope I soon embarked.
But now I have become a man,
And doubt the promise of the plan.

For the path is growing steeper,
And a slip could mean my death.
Plunging upward, ever deeper,
I can barely catch my breath.
Oh, where within this untamed wild
Is the star that led me as a child?

As I crest the shadowed mountain,
I embrace the endless sky;
The expanse of heaven’s fountain
Now unfolds before my eye.
A thousand stars shine on the land,
The chart drafted by my own hand.

Sam Harris said that the timing of when young Earth creationists claim God created the Universe:

… is, incidentally, about a thousand years after the Sumerians invented glue. [Link goes to The Onion]

Robert Ingersoll:

Anger is a wind which blows out the lamp of the mind.

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every season i put out the best batch o’ comments that i’ve found in the last few months.  this edition may be my best yet!

Kirk Wilson

To say that the earth is only 6,000 years old is the mathematical equivalent of saying its radius is only 28 feet.

PZ Myers on an evolution-inspired school t-shirt:

Evolution is not a religion, no more than sky-is-blueism or gravityism or medicine or mathematics or their shop class. Would they shut down an auto repair class if an Amish family decried their heathen English ways? Pollitt is a pandering moron.

John Remy (from this personal, well-written post on his LDS ex-communication ritual):

Hopefully we’ll see each other as complex humans, worthy of compassion.  [there's a lot of wisdom in these words!]

George Hrab:

Is sex with your clone gay or just extroverted masturbation? (more…)

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a little late in posting this, but here goes!:

stephen hawking, der spiegel (17 october 1988):

we are just an advanced breed of monkeys on a minor planet of a very average star. but we can understand the universe. that makes us something very special.

Saki:

A little inaccuracy sometimes saves tons of explanation.

Gerry Spence:

I would rather have a mind opened by wonder than one closed by belief.

fred doyle:

Space isn’t remote at all. It’s only an hour’s drive away if your car could go straight upwards.

Tri-fecta of doubt….

Carl Sagan:

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

Marcello Truzzi:

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

Pierre-Simon Marquis de Laplace

The weight of evidence for an extraordinary claim must be proportioned to its strangeness.

Paul Bert :

Modern societies march towards morality in proportion as they leave religion behind.

Louis Pasteur

When I approach a child, he inspires in me two sentiments; tenderness for what he is, and respect for what he may become.

Charles Richet

I never said it was possible. I only said it was true.

Jean Rostand

I should have no use for a paradise in which I should be deprived of the right to prefer hell.

Jean Rostand

In order to remain true to oneself one ought to renounce one’s party three times a day.

Publilius Syrus:

I have often regretted my speech, never my silence.

Dale McGowen (author of Raising Children Beyond Belief):

Much of the protest over “nonbeliever” is that it defines us in terms of religious believers. I care about this no more than the fact that “nonsmoker” defines me in terms of smokers and “non-idiot” defines me in terms of idiots. You don’t find many non sequiturs up in arms about being defined in terms of the hated sequitur, nor are the nondescript or noncommital often irate about comparisons to the descript and commital.

Mahatma Gandhi and Martin Luther King, Jr. seemed not to find their advocacy of nonviolence diminished by the lexical negation of violence. Nor does Nonviolent Peaceforce, the nonpartisan, nonprofit NGO (that’s “non-governmental organization”) for which I work. For each and all of these terms, the prefix is a non-issue.

So why do we continue to waste our pique on such terms as “nonbeliever” and “nonreligious”? I find them both useful and economical. Pile on your polysyllables and modifiers as you wish. I have things to do.

Jean Rostand

Kill a man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conquerer. Kill everyone, and you are a god.

Jean Rostand

Science has made us gods even before we are worthy of being men.

Jean Rostand

The divine is perhaps that quality in man which permits him to endure the lack of God.

Jean Rostand

When a scientist is ahead of his times, it is often through misunderstanding of current, rather than intuition of future truth. In science there is never any error so gross that it won’t one day, from some perspective, appear prophetic.

Alexis de Tocqueville

Consider any individual at any period of his life, and you will always find him preoccupied with fresh plans to increase his comfort.

He was as great as a man can be without morality.
Alexis de Tocqueville

History is a gallery of pictures in which there are few originals and many copies.
Alexis de Tocqueville

Slayer (lyrics):

Holy man open up your eyes
To the ways of the world you’ve been so blind
As the walls of religion come crashing down
How’s the ignorance taste the second time around

Tell me how it feels knowing chaos will never end
Tell me what it’s like when the celebration begins

Welcome to the horror of the revelation
Tell me what you think of your savior now
I reject all the Biblical views of the truth
Dismiss it as the folklore of the times
I won’t be force fed prophecies
From a book of untruths for the weakest mind
Join the new faith for the celebration
Cult of new faith fuels the devastation

[Read the complete lyrics]

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this question was posed on the skepchic blog:

When you spend time with your family (direct or distant) for the holidays, do you have to temporarily change anything about yourself, skeptical, religious or otherwise?  Do you find yourself acting differently either for the sake of harmony or simply because that’s how you’ve always related to them (no pun intended)?  Is that good or bad?

yesterday was thanksgiving, and thus i was around much of my family. running late for dinner, i threw on a shirt out the door we fly to mom and dad’s.

i did not read what was written on my random shirt, however:

Rebel of Faith

it’s a cool-looking t.- a slim-you-down black, painted with those ruby-red heretic words. problem is, the ruby red caught everyone’s eyes. first was my dear 80-year old mormon grandmother’s. her eyes were better than i had imagined: “rebel of faith?”, she inquired.

“yes, it means rebel FOR faith”. i quickly responded. i was lying, and i was proud of my apostasy, but not to my grandma. not when she has lived a long life FOR faith. so deep was her belief in her holy fairy tale for all of these years that the very neurons and connections in her mind can never again be unwoven. critical thinking and skepticism will not squeeze through the plaque and cholesterol polluting her mind’s neural tubes.

it’s over. SHE’s almost over. i say go with the flow. leave her happy. let her leave happy. when i noticed i had an extra shirt in the car, i changed it for her. and by the look on my mom’s face, i could see she felt relieved as well.

it was just a random shirt from my closet, without any agenda meant by me. i am proud of my heresy, and proud to be a “rebel of faith”, but thanksgiving this year was of a much higher quality leaving religion aside and focusing on family.

[here are some great links on thanksgiving]:

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John Remy has this gem on Mormons and profanity:

When it comes to my English-speaking Mormon friends, few things amaze me more than their aversion to the use of profanity.  Some will spend hours patiently defending systemic racial discrimination or a father’s attempt to slit his son’s throat in God’s name, but will recoil at the use of a common word for excrement.

Ernestine Rose:

It is an interesting and demonstrable fact, that all children are
atheists and were religion not inculcated into their minds, they would
remain so.

Bart Simpson saying grace:

Dear God: We paid for all this stuff ourselves, so thanks for nothing. (more…)

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hopefully you’ve checked out all of the safran vs. god episodes (all 8 of them).  they’re great!  lots of laughs and religious skepticism.  but the last episode, safran actually gets possessed.  it’s a trip to watch and safran has never cleared up what happened.  he actually believes it may have been real, as do his camera crew.  watch the video:

so what happened? well i think i’ve figured out something plausible… first of all, this is most likely just hypnotism, or in other words a mutually agreed upon play between the exorciser and the “possessed”. in order for suggestive hypnotism to work, the receiver must be highly or moderately suggestible. i believe safran is quite suggestible: in watching all 8 episodes of safran vs. god you see safran being OPEN to new religions and worldviews. although he maintains a skeptical outlook during his experiences, he DOES want to experience “the spiritual” through drinking peyote all night, and in another episode says “i hope i really do get possessed tonight” while attending a Voodoo ceremony and seeing others dance and writhe on the ground. Clearly he was open, susceptible and suggestible. as far as i’ve read, any interviews after this video took place show safran actually believing what happened was real.*

in addition to safran’s suggestive demeanor, he gives himself over to the services of an extremely professional, intimidating and psychological bully. this seasoned mindfucker plays on safran’s fragile feelings of guilt and filthiness**, while feeding him fear of satan and christ. add to this how scary it would be to be commanded to keep looking into this crazy dudes eyes as he slaps you around with a bible and your done. i felt intimidated, threatened and scared just watching this, imagine now if someone controls not only what you are seeing, and thinking, but also controls your body movement by holding you down? your mind can freak out and will play along if the exorciser paints the hallucionoginic picture well enough.

any other thoughts/explanations?

 

*although not accepting any particular theology over another.
**remember the catholic father episode where he repents?

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Ateismo

(videos are in Portuguese)

God- John Lennon

Quantas pessoas Jeová matou? (How many people did Jehovah kill?)

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When I once looked into the heavens
And into the starry lit sky
I thought I could see your wonder
And thought I could never deny

That you were the Rock of Ages
The potter, and I the clay
That you were my creator
For whom I could only obey

That on the Cross you suffered
Died and rose again
My burden was yours to bear
The sorrow, the grief, the pain

But despite all that you did for me
I still could not see your face
In the shadows you remained hidden
From every conceivable place

I then cried out to you
I gave you my soul, my all
But all you gave me was silence
Silence to my desperate call

When I now look into the heavens
And into the starry lit sky
I now know you are not there
Looking down from up high

For you do not live amongst the stars
But only within my mind
For I shaped you in my image
Within my head you are confined

Because I now know the truth, Yeshua
And I’m sorry to say
That I am in fact the potter
And you, are in fact, the clay

By Kevin Parry

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Happy Autumn Equinox!

every three months i post a lump of good quotes i heard/read during the season (click on the category ‘quotes‘ on my sidebar to see my on-going collection). so, here are the quotes i’ve rounded up during this year’s summer season!

Dr. Perry Cox:

Lady, people aren’t chocolates.. Do you know what they are mostly?  Bastards.  Bastard-coated bastards with bastard filling.  But I don’t find them half as annoying as I find naive, bubble-headed optimists who walk around vomiting sunshine.

Woody Allen:

What if everything is an illusion and nothing exists? In that case, I definitely overpaid for my carpet.

Joh Stewart:

Religion. It’s given people hope in a world torn apart by religion.

Barack Obama:

If you get a federal grant you can’t use that grant money to proselytize to the people you help and you can’t discriminate against them – or against the people you hire – on the basis of their religion.

Richard Dawkins

What are all of us but self-reproducing robots? We have been put together by our genes and what we do is roam the world looking for a way to sustain ourselves and ultimately produce another robot child. (more…)

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oops!  i’m a little late on this one, but…

every three months i post a lump of good quotes i heard/read during the season (click on the category ‘quotes‘ on my sidebar to see my on-going collection). so, here are the quotes i’ve rounded up during this year’s spring season!

the first bunch came from mike‘s blog:

Bart Simpson:

Phew I’m glad we came to our senses and worship a 2.000 year old carpenter.

Bill Hicks:

If I thought the Jews killed God, I’d worship the Jews.

Woody Allen:

If only God would give me some clear sign! Like making a large deposit in my name at a Swiss bank.

Homer Simpson:

Suppose we’ve chosen the wrong god. Every time we go to church we’re just making him madder.

Homer Simpson:

I’m normally not a praying man, but if you’re up there, save me Superman! (more…)

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taken from belief-o-matic religion quiz.  i ranked a hard-core humanist, and a soft-core nontheist- which sounds just about right to me.  i also took this quiz two years ago- right when i had started to really deal with doubt.  it’s interesting to see secular humanism jumping up to the top (from 73-100%); U.U. dropping a little; Buddhism staying strong in the top 6; and my LDS/Mormon beliefs dropping from a score of 49% all the way down to 26%.

1. Secular Humanism (100%)
2. Unitarian Universalism (92%)
3. Liberal Quakers (78%)
4. Nontheist (72%)
5. Mainline to Liberal Christian Protestants (69%)
6. Theravada Buddhism (68%)
7. Neo-Pagan (67%)
8. New Age (58%)
9. Reform Judaism (54%)
10. Taoism (52%)
11. Mahayana Buddhism (48%)
12. Orthodox Quaker (44%)
13. Bahá’í Faith (41%)
14. Scientology (41%)
15. New Thought (39%)
16. Sikhism (38%)
17. Jainism (35%)
18. Christian Science (Church of Christ, Scientist) (34%)
19. Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints (Mormons) (26%)
20. Mainline to Conservative Christian/Protestant (26%)
21. Islam (25%)
22. Orthodox Judaism (25%)
23. Hinduism (19%)
24. Eastern Orthodox (17%)
25. Roman Catholic (17%)
26. Seventh Day Adventist (17%)
27. Jehovah’s Witness (7%)

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taken from the chapter on faith:

my mother, even with all her professed secularism, was in many ways  the most spiritually awakened person that i’ve ever known.

she had an unswerving instinct for kindness, charity and love.  and spent much of her life acting on that instinct.  sometimes to her detriment.  without the help of religious texts, or outside authorities, she worked mightily to instill in me the values that many americans learn in sunday school.  honesty, empathy, discipline, delayed gratification and hard work.

[...] most of all, she possesed an abiding sense wonder. ar reverence for life and its precious transitory nature that could properly be described as devotional.  she saw mysteries everywhere, and took joy in the sheer strangeness of life.

he continues about how he did not have “a vessel for his beliefs”, nor a community for beleif, and thus he has embraced christianity.

listen to excerpt here:  http://www.fileden.com/files/2006/11/18/392548/Audacity_Faith.mp3

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stuff i’ve found well worth the movement of a mouse, followed by a click:

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battle of the wits!  see if you can out-smart the smarmy atheist

link to game

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i thought these were…uhh… interesting.

enjoy.

(more…)

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doug stanhope

good stand-up on the bible, christians and death, and religion…

via atheist media

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Childish superstition: Einstein’s letter makes view of religion relatively clear | Science | The Guardian

“Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind.” So said Albert Einstein, and his famous aphorism has been the source of endless debate between believers and non-believers wanting to claim the greatest scientist of the 20th century as their own.A little known letter written by him, however, may help to settle the argument – or at least provoke further controversy about his views. (more…)

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we are just an advanced breed of monkeys on a minor planet of a very average star. but we can understand the universe. that makes us something very special. (Stephen Hawking)

tonight i watched into the wild on my ipod. i watched while lying in my bed, before going to sleep. my short 2-3 sentence review is this: thank you, mr. krakauer for letting me vicariously live a fantasy of going into the wild and being one w/ nature. i also learned thru the experience of christopher (the main character in the story), that “happiness is only real when shared” (he wrote these words towards the end of his lonely, soul-searching journey to alaska). there’s got to be a way to be one with the world and continue our relationships around us, too. this is a new goal for me to live by. tonight my wife shared a poem with me that said: “real tragedy is not death, but a life not lived” (more…)

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via the skeptics’ guide.

Dr. Steven Novella responds to a popular essay entitled “Strategies for Dialoguing with Atheists”.

a part i thought interesting was on human suffering as proof for or against god. Steven says:

As I stated [previously], this is not a serious argument against God in any case. But since Rhodes is throwing the challenge out there, I can think of some ways to drastically reduce human evil that should not violate anything. Human nature can be tweaked without violating any notion of free will (whatever that means, but that’s a different post). Perhaps humans can become a bit less tribal and blood thirsty, for example. Also, much crime and evil comes from desperate situations. How about a moratorium on natural disasters for awhile, and stop throwing new diseases at us. Anyway, that’s a good start. I’m sure given eternity an omniscient being might just have a few more ideas at their disposal.

another interesting thing steven brings up here is free will. many of the religious believe that god does not stop evil or natural disasters from happening because this interferes with free will. well what is a miracle, if not an interception with one’s free will or the natural course of nature?

Rhodes ends his article inviting his theist defenders to stick with “demonstrating the logical impossiblities of atheistic claims”. Dr. Novella’s response:

Wow, this guy needs to get out more. I may suggest that it is a flawed strategy for the faithful to confront non-believers with logic. That is not a field of combat they wish to take – as evidenced by Rhode’s effort. Talk about bringing a pea-shooter to a gun fight.

To be clear, I have nothing against people of faith – as long as they keep their faith, faith. But “logical evidence for faith” is an oxymoron. Once you enter the arena of evidence or logic – prepare for a smackdown.

the only other time i have heard steven novella talk about religion and agnosticism is on the reason driven podcast, episode 10. listen for a great discussion on agnosticism vs. atheism and steven’s own critiques of faith.

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this pretty much sums it up in an intelligent, non-extreme way. for some reason i really enjoyed this comic- it shows many honorable attributes creationists have and that they really don’t have any misconceptions towards us infidels (link to comic; found via Pharyngula

read the rest of the comic here (it’s worth it)!

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the following post, along with POI’s recent podcast with Austin Dacey have helped me re-think some of my views towards the moderately religious.

writerdd (of the skepchick blog) had this interesting post which i respect since it’s coming from an open and skeptical mind:

Should We Embrace Moderate Christianity? (more…)

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John has converted! he tells me he’s a humanist now (via e-mail), and his facebook account lists his religious views as “mormon humanist”.

i’m (pretty) sure his love of mormonism continues strong. i personally think he loves the community aspect, not to mention that mormonism is his (and my) roots, and it’s difficult to turn away from that. most of us want to stay true to our culture and heritage, right?

as for me, it’s not as hard to turn my back on my family religion/heritage as i am simply doing the same as my ancestors: leaving the religion of my fathers for some higher truths.

also, bob mccue has said in a podcast interview, “i prefer to take these arrows [of dissafection] now in my life so that my children don’t have to go through it in theirs”. i find that honorable.

whatever and wherever john ends up, though, i admire him greatly. few have any idea at all how much he has reached out to dissafected LDS on a personal level. he’s the epitomy of a truly good neighbor in the community and a friend to all. his theme has been “building bridges” (between faiths, and believers/non-believers, etc.) and he’ll continue to do good wherever he goes.

please check out his large collection of work:

more on “J-Dizzle”: http://mormonmatters.org/2008/04/20/eulogy-to-john-dehlin/

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another problem with the noah’s arc story: the story of genetic variation in the cheetah (which started inbreeding 10,000 years ago from an extremely small population) should  look homologous to all other species who, as the story goes, started inbreeding only 4000 years ago and from an even smaller population (of two).

for the article mentioned in the video click here

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i really enjoyed reading this letter.  some great information on hitler’s religious views are summarized here.  if this jew’s reaction to the film is typical, expelled is much more evil than i initially imagined.  letter via:

On 18th April, the day Ben Stein‘s infamous film was released, Michael Shermer received the following letter from a Jew (referencing a past article that Shermer had written debunking the Holocaust deniers) whose identity I shall conceal as “David J”.

Now I truly understand who you atheists and darwinists really are! You people believe that it was okay for my great-grandparents to die in the Holocaust! How disgusting. Your past article about the Holocaust was just window dressing. We Jews will fight to keep people like you out of the United States!

Shermer wrote to Mr J to ask if he had by any chance just seen Expelled, and he received this reply:

Yes I have. You know, I respect you as a human being and you have done great work exposing psychics and frauds, but this is a very touchy issue that affects me and family emotionally. Our family business was affected because of Auschwitz because now, our family has nothing. It is gone. Things began to make sense once I saw the movie and I am just appalled. I have learned a lot from Ben Stein, a Jewish brother, who has opened my eyes up a bit. (more…)

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i’ve listened to some sound bytes of Rook debating christians during a couple of live chats they’ve hosted. he’s really fun to listen to and really knowledgeable. anyways, on his blog he just posted a story that just happened with him. He was working at the bookstore and ended up getting into a half hour long conversation with a Jehovah’s witness. pressed for time, they decided to continue the conversation via e-mail. Rook’s first e-mail response to the jw bring up some good issues to consider. here’s his e-mail:

(Name with held to ensure anonymity),

Thanks for your prompt e-mail. Yes, it was a productive conversation. If I listed my concerns, in their entirety, I’m afraid your inbox would be so full it would not allow for other e-mails to be sent to you. With that jocularity in mind, we should perhaps focus on one issue at a time. How about we start once more with the problem of suffering. Allow me to hash out my problem for you. (more…)

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awesome take on faith:

Killing Faith: Deconstructionist Christians (Skeptoid podcast #12) – Is proving the Bible really doing the work of God?
Read | Listen (5:31)

text archived below: (more…)

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links for 2day…

Scientists discover oldest-to-date DNA of humans who lived in america 14,300 years ago! Some Mormons are scratching their heads over this one: a) that the Lamanite story is off by over 10,000 years; and b) how did people exist before God made Adam and Eve 6000 years ago? The study, published in the journal Science, went to extraordinary lengths to try to rule out the possibility that the DNA was the result of modern contamination. The DNA of nearly 70 scientists, archaeologists and students was cross-checked to make sure that it had not inadvertently contaminated the fossilised material. An analysis of the DNA showed that it contained two sets of genetic sequences which are shared with modern-day native Americans and people who are native to East Asia and Siberia – confirming that the first Americans came over the Bering land bridge from Asia during the last Ice Age.

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Thomas Monson, President of LDS ChurchStatements like this illustrate why i’ll never go back to such an organization.

Quote by Thomas Monson, The Lighthouse of the Lord: A Message to the Youth of the Church, Ensign, February 2001:

Remember that faith and doubt cannot exist in the same mind at the same time, for one will dispel the other.

Should doubt knock at your doorway, just say to those skeptical, disturbing, rebellious thoughts: ‘I propose to stay with my faith, with the faith of my people. I know that happiness and contentment are there, and I forbid you, agnostic, doubting thoughts, to destroy the house of my faith. I acknowledge that I do not understand the processes of creation, but I accept the fact of it. I grant that I cannot explain the miracles of the Bible, and I do not attempt to do so, but I accept God’s word. I wasn’t with Joseph, but I believe him. My faith did not come to me through science, and I will not permit so-called science to destroy it.

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farking well done. i laffed my arse off! my wife loved it too.

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…using black magic, of course.

Summary via Pharyngula:

curses.jpg

The laughing fellow on the left is Sanal Edamaruku, president of Rationalist International and atheist. The cranky old man in the robes on the right is Pandit Surinder Sharma, a self-described Tantrik Magician. The scene is in a studio on Indian television, where the magician is trying to kill the atheist with sorcery. Sharma had said he could kill anyone with sympathetic magic inflicted on a doll made of dough, and that he could accomplish this in a mere three minutes … so Edamaruku confidently offered himself as a victim. The old fake went on for hours and failed.

After nearly two hours, the anchor declared the tantrik’s failure. The tantrik, unwilling to admit defeat, tried the excuse that a very strong god whom Sanal might be worshipping obviously protected him. “No, I am an atheist,” said Sanal Edamaruku. Finally, the disgraced tantrik tried to save his face by claiming that there was a never-failing special black magic for ultimate destruction, which could, however, only been done at night. Bad luck again, he did not get away with this, but was challenged to prove his claim this very night in another “breaking news” live program.

Edamaruku obliged and willing went to his “doom” that night.

The encounter took place under the open night sky. The tantrik and his two assistants were kindling a fire and staring into the flames. Sanal was in good humour. Once the ultimate magic was invoked, there wouldn’t be any way back, the tantrik warned. Within two minutes, Sanal would get crazy, and one minute later he would scream in pain and die. Didn’t he want to save his life before it was too late? Sanal laughed, and the countdown begun. The tantriks chanted their “Om lingalingalingalinga, kilikilikili….” followed by ever changing cascades of strange words and sounds. The speed increased hysterically. They threw all kinds of magic ingredients into the flames that produced changing colours, crackling and fizzling sounds and white smoke. While chanting, the tantrik came close to Sanal, moved his hands in front of him and touched him, but was called back by the anchor. After the earlier covert attempts of the tantrik to use force against Sanal, he was warned to keep distance and avoid touching Sanal. But the tantrik “forgot” this rule again and again.

Now the tantrik wrote Sanal’s name on a sheet of paper, tore it into small pieces, dipped them into a pot with boiling butter oil and threw them dramatically into the flames. Nothing happened. Singing and singing, he sprinkled water on Sanal, mopped a bunch of peacock feathers over his head, threw mustard seed into the fire and other outlandish things more. Sanal smiled, nothing happened, and time was running out. Only seven more minutes before midnight, the tantrik decided to use his ultimate weapon: the clod of wheat flour dough. He kneaded it and powdered it with mysterious ingredients, then asked Sanal to touch it. Sanal did so, and the grand magic finale begun. The tantrik pierced blunt nails on the dough, then cut it wildly with a knife and threw them into the fire. That moment, Sanal should have broken down. But he did not. He laughed. Forty more seconds, counted the anchor, twenty, ten, five… it’s over!

Video:  Part 1, Part 2 & Part 3.

Full story archived below: (more…)

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fascinating.  revealing.  these games will twist your brain and logic as you try to defend your own rational and morals.  i was blown away at the moral inconsistencies i have when considering moral obligations closer to my own gene pool and community.

wow.

http://mmagee.com/philclub/games.htm

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Nice video. Cool images and something to really think about.

http://thefutureofourworld.ytmnd.com/

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Happy Spring Equinox!

eis meus predileitos de recem…

Bill Maher:

you can’t be a rational person six days a week…and on one day of the week, go to a building, and think you’re drinking the blood of a two thousand year old space god. via

Prov 14:15, 18:

The simple believeth every word: but the prudent man looketh well to his going…
The simple inherit folly: but the prudent are crowned with knowledge. (more…)

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dayum. soccergirl’s the shiite.

Video: “Fuck You Fox News”

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subtitles in Portuguese

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i would love to see a youtube video of someone citing a scripture from 6, 5, 3, or 1 during a talk at an LDS church!  or on someone’s “missionary plaque”.

Ten Verses Never Preached On (more…)

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entertaining debate on the existence of God. video with images.

(more…)

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2 Kings 2:23-24: (more…)

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…a miracle? of course!

in the news, a new born baby is struggling to live as he was born with his heart outside the thorax.

[in this picture: Dr. Raymond Konane also struggles, as he fights the urge to "bop the gopher back in the hole" as he used to do when playing a favorite arcade game as a child]

a commenter (the first, actually) on the news item, from London, said: “This baby is an absolute miracle!”

yeah…umm.. what part of this is a miracle? the part where modern science and medicine is able to save an infant from the horrible mutator of children that is unintelligent design?

or is the “miracle” the thought that God went out of his way to save this one, while leaving hundreds of thousands elsewhere to die? was this baby more important than another less fortunate? to call this a miracle is to assume that God chose this one over another “non miracle” elsewhere. why call this a miracle, on what grounds can we jump to this conclusion?

why not call this random. why not call this nature? let’s be grateful for this miracle, but let’s give credit where credit is due: modern science and western medicine is saving my life, this baby’s and yours. if we live to see our forties we have much to be thanking science for.

so shout with me: “Hallelujah!”

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When I became convinced that the universe was natural,
That all the ghosts and gods were myths,
There entered into my brain, into my soul, into every drop of my blood,
The sense, the feeling, the joy of freedom.
The walls of my prison crumbled and fell.
The dungeon was flooded with light
And all the bolts and bars and manacles turned to dust.
I was no longer a servant, a serf, or a slave.
There was for me no master in all the wide world, not even in infinite space.
I was free to think free to express my thoughts free to live in my own ideal.
Free to live for myself, and those I loved.
Free to use all my faculties, all my senses.
Free to spread imagination’s wings,
Free to investigate, to guess, and dream and hope.
Free to judge and determine for myself.
Free to reject all ignorant and cruel creeds,
All the inspired books that savages have produced
And the barbarous legends of the past.
Free from sanctified mistakes and holy lies.
Free from the fear of eternal pain,
Free from the winged monsters of the night.
Free from devils, ghosts and gods.
For the first time I was free…
There were no prohibited places in all of the realm of thought.
No error, no space where fancy could not spread her painted wings.
No chains for my limbs.
No lashes for my back.
No flames for my flesh.
No Master’s frown or threat,
No following in another’s steps.
No need to bow or cringe or crawl, or utter lying words.
I was free; I stood erect and fearlessly, joyously faced all worlds.
My heart was filled with gratitude, with thankfulness,
And went out in love to all the heros, the thinkers who gave their lives

For liberty of hand and brain,
For the freedom of labor and thought to those who fell
On the fierce fields of war.
To those who died in dungeons, bound in chains,
To those by fire consumed,
To all the wise, the good, the brave of every land
Whose thoughts and deeds have given freedom to the sons of men.
And then, I vowed to grasp the torch that they held, and hold it high,
That light might conquer darkness still.

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The 9 Most Badass Bible Verses

article image

If the Bible had been written by King Leonidas and the rest of the Spartans from 300, it would probably read pretty much the same as it does now. It turns out, the Bible is already chock full of ass kicking. Here are the verses that make us want to take to the streets and put some unbelievers to the sword.

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what was your first experience with cognitive dissonance, or one of the first times that you realized something didn’t add up in your religious world-view?  for me i have a couple of really early ones (see post here, paragraphs 3 and 4- starting with the words “i think we all of us”- i know great grammar, right).  today i was thinking about the song i mentioned in my previous post by George Hrab called “Heaven Must Be Really Boring” (copy and save link to listen).  this was actually my first cog dis as a little kid.  i thought how boring it was when i absolutely obeyed all of the rules and was super perfect to my friends and family.  i thought how fun it was to be a trouble maker every now and then, doing pranks on people or just joking around and messing with people.  as a kid i didn’t think i could take it being in heaven where jokes must be strictly prohibited (unless you’re telling the latest jokes you heard from your second grader or something off of a laffy taffy wrapper).  “how boring”, i would think to myself.  so that was my first cog dis.  didn’t think the world would be interesting without good and bad, extacy and suffering.  even in the book of mormon it says that those things are necessary to exist together so how could there be a place where everything was sweet, never sour- you never broke a leg or got sick.  how could you savor food after going without for a day?  how could you appreciate the blessing goodness of health and normalcy without going through a few days of having the flu or food poisoning?  after i threw out my back last year for a day i couldn’t wait to just run around- i couldn’t believe the simple things i was taking for granted like being able to sit up and walk!  imagine if that was nothing to me anymore because i could fly anywhere i wanted or even travel by merely thinking of a location (LDS semi-doctrine).  and today i had a brother-in-law call my wife saying he would be so sad if he were a god enjoying his exaltation one day without his sister!   what?  how could you be enjoying your exaltation knowing you had family that was suffering in another place?  that wouldn’t be heaven!  …and all because your sister was a good person, good mother, good wife, good life- but she’s damned b/c she got it wrong when it came to earth’s theology exam?  i don’t believe in that god.  couldn’t imagine him separating people from their loved ones just b/c they couldn’t figure out “the most important message in the world”- that happened to be written in impossible-to-understand parables, and context of the times.  from the reason driven podcast, ep.1 Robert M. Price says:

and so this theoretically inspired book just doesn’t matter as long as it remains ambiguous.  take the part in Corinthians- if the trumpet call is not clear who’s going to come to battle, or who’s going to know what to do?

we’re right to be showing some skepticism towards this gospel that shows a cruel god in the old testament and immoral behavior in the NT.  and what if god, being a scientist himself (he created the elements and the universe, right? that makes him a scientist in my book), would he possibly applaud skeptical thought from an individual over blind faith from the same person?  would he not respect you more if you were honest to yourself and “doubted” than if you just said “shut up, brain” and insisted on believing?

my other cog dis as a kid was when i was 7 (under the age of accountability), not yet baptized and i saw a picture of a woman in a swimsuit.  i realized to myself that i could have sex with a girl if i wanted to (now that i think of it though i probably wouldn’t have been very successful picking up a girl) and it wouldn’t be a sin yet since i wasn’t baptized and didn’t have “the age of accountability” yet.  i realized i could do anything in the world and it would be okay.  i ended up deciding to just be a kid, play some pranks on people, joke around with my friends, maybe even tell some dirty jokes- in the end, i just wanted to have fun.

what was your first cog dis? comment below.

for more stories of first cog dis’s, see here.

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listening to episode 4 of the Reason Driven Podcast, i had the opportunity to listen to an out-spoken atheist named George Hrab. check out the interesting conversation and Hrab’s cool “heaven would be boring” song at the end of the podcast.  they also discuss the kurzweil’s theory on the singularity and where technology could take us, and how we’ll never be able to destroy this world (it would recover from probably anything we could do) but we could destroy ourselves one day.  a lot of interesting topics covered in this episode.

what i like most about this new podcast is that the hosts (or at least one of them) is new to freethinking after a year and a half of research into his own religion (fundamental christianity).  the questions he asks his guests a lot of the time sound like things i would be asking, too as i am also new to this world view.   give it a listen- start with episode 1 (my favorite so far).

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while reading blake’s about me section, he mentioned the following article. i think this could be a good article for my family to read to help understand my disbelief.

i’m especially glad the author came to his conclusion about “type 4″ atheists (see article) because i myself believe that once someone who has diligently studied, dissected and contemplated his/her own religion and has come to the conclusion that it is not divine, i find it extremely difficult for them to go back to the faith. especially (as in my case) as reason and logical thinking have been learned and practiced, it is very difficult to go back to faith or to even see “faith” as any kind of a virtue at all.

to read the full article, go here

or,

(more…)

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